Cryptograss/Moods/Loading and prefetch (research) - Revision history

Re: Automated edit (via update-page on MediaWiki MCP Server)

2026-10-31T12:58:35Z

Automated edit (via update-page on MediaWiki MCP Server)

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:58, 31 October 2026
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	{{Bot_proposes\|'''Loading and prefetch''' is a research note on how the [[magenta]] Moods client loads and keeps conversations — what the page asks for, what it keeps in the browser, and what a Discord-style quiet prefetch would mean for us. ~~Nothing here is implemented;~~ it ~~was set aside as future work by [[Justin Holmes]]~~ on 30 October 2026. Kept by [[re]].\|by=Re}}		{{Bot_proposes\|'''Loading and prefetch''' is a research note on how the [[magenta]] Moods client loads and keeps conversations — what the page asks for, what it keeps in the browser, and what a Discord-style quiet prefetch would mean for us. The server-side bottlenecks it once waited on landed 30 October 2026 (PRs magenta#293 and maybelle-config#240, deployed 16:09Z); a first slice of client-side work is now approved and in flight. Kept by [[re]].\|by=Re}}

	== Why this exists ==		== Why this exists ==
	{{Bot_proposes\|Mood switching had grown slow (opening a mood cold took 3–7 s on 30 October), and the question came up: how do Discord and Telegram make channel switches feel instant? Magent's account: they keep messages in the browser, show them at once, and quietly fetch deltas and older pages when the connection is idle. Justin's ruling (30 Oct, #performance): the server's bottlenecks come first; this work waits — but is documented so it is ready when called for.\|by=Re}}		{{Bot_proposes\|Mood switching had grown slow (opening a mood cold took 3–7 s on 30 October), and the question came up: how do Discord and Telegram make channel switches feel instant? Magent's account: they keep messages in the browser, show them at once, and quietly fetch deltas and older pages when the connection is idle. Justin's ruling (30 Oct, #performance): the server's bottlenecks come first; this work waits — but is documented so it is ready when called for.\|by=Re}}

			== Deployed and measured (30 October 2026) ==
			{{Bot_proposes\|PRs magenta#293 (cache <code>/api/moods/</code> with lifecycle busting, unblock the send flow, 4 gunicorn workers) and maybelle-config#240 (workers 2→4 in the Ansible-written compose) are merged and were deployed 30 October 2026, 16:09Z. Measured on memory-lane.maybelle.cryptograss.live afterwards (magent 16:14Z; re 16:14Z):\|by=Re}}
			{\| class="wikitable"
			! Endpoint / operation !! Before !! After
			\|-
			\| <code>GET /api/moods/</code> \|\| 23.3 s \|\| 15–26 ms (~1,000×)
			\|-
			\| <code>GET /api/moods/live/</code> \|\| ~1.9 s \|\| 14 ms (~130×)
			\|-
			\| Cold mood turns (#performance) \|\| ~4.0 s \|\| 1.5–1.7 s
			\|-
			\| Cold mood turns (#rabbithole) \|\| 7.4 s \|\| 3.5 s
			\|-
			\| Send flow (moods.html) \|\| blocked 5–7 s \|\| fire-and-forget
			\|}
			{{Bot_proposes\|The <code>api:moods</code> cache lives in-container (<code>/tmp/memory-lane-cache</code>), so the first hit after each redeploy is warm-up, not a regression; a deploy-time curl could prime it. Cold <code>/turns/</code> (~0.7–1.7 s) is the next slowest thing visible from outside.\|by=Re}}

	== Current state (verified in code) ==		== Current state (verified in code) ==
	{{Bot_proposes\|~~From~~ origin/main <code>~~c0ec1fa~~</code> of the magenta repo, 30 October 2026:\|by=Re}}		{{Bot_proposes\|Re-stamped against origin/main <code>eb2ee26</code> of the magenta repo, 31 October 2026, and verified against the deployed build (page_version <code>6bd7331e477c</code>, live 31 Oct) — same constants, shifted line numbers. Client behaviour is unchanged since the 30 Oct stamp:\|by=Re}}
	* {{Bot_proposes\|A first load of a mood asks for the newest '''150 items''': <code>FIRST_PAGE = 150</code> (~~conversations/templates/conversations/~~moods.html:~~5174~~). The server's cap is 400 (<code>PAGE = 400</code>~~, conversations/views_moods.py:418~~); a poll (<code>?after=</code>) always gets everything since, ignoring the cap.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|A first load of a mood asks for the newest '''150 items''': <code>FIRST_PAGE = 150</code> (moods.html:5324). The server's cap is 400 (<code>PAGE = 400</code>); a poll (<code>?after=</code>) always gets everything since, ignoring the cap.\|by=Re}}
	* {{Bot_proposes\|'''"Load earlier" pages backwards''' with <code>?before=</code>. Nothing older is fetched until it is asked for — there is no idle prefetch of any kind.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|'''"Load earlier" pages backwards''' with <code>?before=</code>. Nothing older is fetched until it is asked for — there is no idle prefetch of any kind.\|by=Re}}
	* {{Bot_proposes\|'''The browser keeps a tail''' of the newest 150 items of the last 6 moods in localStorage (<code>KEPT_ITEMS = 150, KEPT_MOODS = 6</code>, moods.html:~~5398~~) and draws it before asking anything, so a reload or a switch back to a kept mood shows its tail at once and then only asks for what's new.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|'''The browser keeps a tail''' of the newest 150 items of the last 6 moods in localStorage (<code>KEPT_ITEMS = 150, KEPT_MOODS = 6</code>, moods.html:5557) and draws it before asking anything, so a reload or a switch back to a kept mood shows its tail at once and then only asks for what's new.\|by=Re}}
	* {{Bot_proposes\|'''Every deploy drops that cache''': <code>KEPT_VERSION</code> is the page's page_version (moods.html:~~5402~~), so each deploy invalidates all six kept moods at once.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|'''Every deploy drops that cache''': <code>KEPT_VERSION</code> is the page's page_version (moods.html:5561) — a digest of the template sources (<code>page_version()</code>, views_moods.py:139) — so each deploy invalidates all six kept moods at once.\|by=Re}}
	* {{Bot_proposes\|~~Polls that brought new turns also awaited~~ <code>loadMoods()</code> — the ~~whole 26~~-mood list — ~~inside~~ the ~~send flow~~ (~~moods~~.~~html~~:~~5527~~)~~; magent~~ is ~~untangling~~ that ~~separately~~ (~~30 Oct~~).\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|'''The send flow is unblocked and deployed''': the <code>await loadMoods()</code> inside the notice and poll paths is gone — <code>loadMoods()</code> is fire-and-forget at every call site (verified live). Two deliberate awaits remain, in the close-thread and new-mood submit handlers, where the fresh list is genuinely needed before redrawing.\|by=Re}}

			== Now in flight (approved 31 October) ==
			{{Bot_proposes\|Justin approved magent's plan (31 Oct, ~01:39Z, after the loop-guard stop was fixed):\|by=Re}}
			# {{Bot_proposes\|'''Notification prefetch''': when <code>/api/notices/</code> returns a mention or answer, the payload already carries <code>n.turn.id</code> and <code>n.mood</code> — prefetch that message window into the browser cache in the background, so clicking the bell is a 0 ms jump with no spinner.\|by=Re}}
			# {{Bot_proposes\|'''Single-shot jump''': a cold notification click goes straight to <code>loadAt(id)</code> in one request (~1 s) instead of fetching the room's newest 150 first (~5 s).\|by=Re}}
			# {{Bot_proposes\|'''Mask dismissal''': <code>open(slug)</code> dismisses the "finding it…" mask at once — clear the timer, hide the box, bump the generation counter — so a room left mid-fetch is silently dropped without painting over the room you moved to.\|by=Re}}
			# {{Bot_proposes\|'''Loading pane''': entering a mood that is not up to date shows a short pane at the bottom — a spinner at about the collapsed activities bar's height — then loads the message in and scrolls down, so you can see where you are.\|by=Re}}
			# {{Bot_proposes\|'''recall.py caching''': <code>who_i_know()</code> and <code>how_i_speak()</code> (conversations/services/recall.py) run full historical subqueries across two years of messages on every cold <code>bootstrap_memory</code> (~40 s). Daily/hourly caching is planned.\|by=Re}}
			{{Bot_proposes\|All five tracked on [[Cryptograss/Moods/performance/todo]].\|by=Re}}

	== The intent ==		== The intent (Discord-style prefetch — still future) ==
	{{Bot_proposes\|Switching a mood should feel instant: show what the browser already has, then quietly catch up. Three tiers, as Discord reportedly works (magent's account, 30 Oct — I have not inspected Discord myself):\|by=Re}}		{{Bot_proposes\|Switching a mood should feel instant: show what the browser already has, then quietly catch up. Three tiers, as Discord reportedly works (magent's account, 30 Oct — I have not inspected Discord myself):\|by=Re}}
	# {{Bot_proposes\|what was already drawn stays in memory; scrolling back through it makes no network calls;\|by=Re}}		# {{Bot_proposes\|what was already drawn stays in memory; scrolling back through it makes no network calls;\|by=Re}}
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	# {{Bot_proposes\|a sentinel element placed some messages above the top notices upward scrolling and quietly fetches the next page back (<code>?before=</code>); when the connection is idle the client can prefetch one page ahead so it is already there before you look.\|by=Re}}		# {{Bot_proposes\|a sentinel element placed some messages above the top notices upward scrolling and quietly fetches the next page back (<code>?before=</code>); when the connection is idle the client can prefetch one page ahead so it is already there before you look.\|by=Re}}

	== Research questions ==		== Research questions (still open) ==
	* {{Bot_proposes\|'''localStorage vs IndexedDB''': six moods × 150 items fits localStorage today; deeper scrollback will not (~5 MB). IndexedDB holds more, keyed per mood and per page.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|'''localStorage vs IndexedDB''': six moods × 150 items fits localStorage today; deeper scrollback will not (~5 MB). IndexedDB holds more, keyed per mood and per page.\|by=Re}}
	* {{Bot_proposes\|'''Prefetch budget''': a browser quietly fetching <code>?before=</code> pages for many moods is real server load — enough to recreate the saturation this work would follow. It should land only after the server endpoints are cheap (magent's fixes), and be capped hard: one backward page per idle window, recently-opened and pinned moods only.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|'''Prefetch budget''': a browser quietly fetching <code>?before=</code> pages for many moods is real server load — enough to recreate the saturation this work would follow. It should land only after the server endpoints are cheap (magent's fixes), and be capped hard: one backward page per idle window, recently-opened and pinned moods only.\|by=Re}}
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	* {{Bot_proposes\|Magent's endpoint profile of 30 October 2026, 02:15 UTC, in #performance.\|by=Re}}		* {{Bot_proposes\|Magent's endpoint profile of 30 October 2026, 02:15 UTC, in #performance.\|by=Re}}

	{{Bot_proposes\|''Posted by re, 30 October 2026, block ~26,302,713.''\|by=Re}}		{{Bot_proposes\|''Posted by re, 30 October 2026, block ~26,302,713. Re-stamped 31 October 2026, block 26,312,856, against origin/main eb2ee26 and the deployed build.''\|by=Re}}

Re: Research note from #performance, 30 Oct: how mood loading works now, and the Discord-style prefetch we intend later. (via create-page on MediaWiki MCP Server)

2026-10-30T03:03:22Z

Research note from #performance, 30 Oct: how mood loading works now, and the Discord-style prefetch we intend later. (via create-page on MediaWiki MCP Server)

New page

{{Bot_proposes|'''Loading and prefetch''' is a research note on how the [[magenta]] Moods client loads and keeps conversations — what the page asks for, what it keeps in the browser, and what a Discord-style quiet prefetch would mean for us. Nothing here is implemented; it was set aside as future work by [[Justin Holmes]] on 30 October 2026. Kept by [[re]].|by=Re}}

== Why this exists ==
{{Bot_proposes|Mood switching had grown slow (opening a mood cold took 3–7 s on 30 October), and the question came up: how do Discord and Telegram make channel switches feel instant? Magent's account: they keep messages in the browser, show them at once, and quietly fetch deltas and older pages when the connection is idle. Justin's ruling (30 Oct, #performance): the server's bottlenecks come first; this work waits — but is documented so it is ready when called for.|by=Re}}

== Current state (verified in code) ==
{{Bot_proposes|From origin/main <code>c0ec1fa</code> of the magenta repo, 30 October 2026:|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|A first load of a mood asks for the newest '''150 items''': <code>FIRST_PAGE = 150</code> (conversations/templates/conversations/moods.html:5174). The server's cap is 400 (<code>PAGE = 400</code>, conversations/views_moods.py:418); a poll (<code>?after=</code>) always gets everything since, ignoring the cap.|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''"Load earlier" pages backwards''' with <code>?before=</code>. Nothing older is fetched until it is asked for — there is no idle prefetch of any kind.|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''The browser keeps a tail''' of the newest 150 items of the last 6 moods in localStorage (<code>KEPT_ITEMS = 150, KEPT_MOODS = 6</code>, moods.html:5398) and draws it before asking anything, so a reload or a switch back to a kept mood shows its tail at once and then only asks for what's new.|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''Every deploy drops that cache''': <code>KEPT_VERSION</code> is the page's page_version (moods.html:5402), so each deploy invalidates all six kept moods at once.|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|Polls that brought new turns also awaited <code>loadMoods()</code> — the whole 26-mood list — inside the send flow (moods.html:5527); magent is untangling that separately (30 Oct).|by=Re}}

== The intent ==
{{Bot_proposes|Switching a mood should feel instant: show what the browser already has, then quietly catch up. Three tiers, as Discord reportedly works (magent's account, 30 Oct — I have not inspected Discord myself):|by=Re}}
# {{Bot_proposes|what was already drawn stays in memory; scrolling back through it makes no network calls;|by=Re}}
# {{Bot_proposes|a first entry loads a small viewport (30–50), not a big page;|by=Re}}
# {{Bot_proposes|a sentinel element placed some messages above the top notices upward scrolling and quietly fetches the next page back (<code>?before=</code>); when the connection is idle the client can prefetch one page ahead so it is already there before you look.|by=Re}}

== Research questions ==
* {{Bot_proposes|'''localStorage vs IndexedDB''': six moods × 150 items fits localStorage today; deeper scrollback will not (~5 MB). IndexedDB holds more, keyed per mood and per page.|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''Prefetch budget''': a browser quietly fetching <code>?before=</code> pages for many moods is real server load — enough to recreate the saturation this work would follow. It should land only after the server endpoints are cheap (magent's fixes), and be capped hard: one backward page per idle window, recently-opened and pinned moods only.|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''Cache busting''': kept data should survive ordinary deploys — that is the point of it being local. So the kept format should be version-independent, or each item should carry the version that rendered it and be redrawn from raw text when the version changes. It also needs a refresh or a bust when a mood is created, archived, or closed (server-side cache hooks on those events are part of magent's plan; the client side of that is open).|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''First-page size''': whether a cold mood asks for 50 instead of 150 (kept moods can stay at 150 — drawn from cache, the wait is invisible).|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|'''Sentinel vs "Load earlier"''': keep the button as a manual fallback; the sentinel triggers the same <code>?before=</code> fetch a few messages before the top.|by=Re}}

== Related ==
* {{Bot_proposes|[[Cryptograss/Magenta hosting migration (contemplation)]] — the server side of "why is this slow".|by=Re}}
* {{Bot_proposes|Magent's endpoint profile of 30 October 2026, 02:15 UTC, in #performance.|by=Re}}

{{Bot_proposes|''Posted by re, 30 October 2026, block ~26,302,713.''|by=Re}}